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	<title>Comments on: Points for Everything!</title>
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	<link>http://quietbabylon.com/2010/points-for-everything/</link>
	<description>Cyborgs, architects and our weird broken future.</description>
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		<title>By: 12. Playing with the Past &#124; History 9808</title>
		<link>http://quietbabylon.com/2010/points-for-everything/comment-page-1/#comment-1857</link>
		<dc:creator>12. Playing with the Past &#124; History 9808</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 00:05:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://quietbabylon.com/?p=1735#comment-1857</guid>
		<description>[...] Maly, &#8220;Points for Everything!&#8221; Quiet Babylon, April [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[…] Maly, “Points for Everything!” Quiet Babylon, April […]</p>
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		<title>By: KinoSport &#124; 750 Words</title>
		<link>http://quietbabylon.com/2010/points-for-everything/comment-page-1/#comment-1541</link>
		<dc:creator>KinoSport &#124; 750 Words</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Apr 2010 03:08:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://quietbabylon.com/?p=1735#comment-1541</guid>
		<description>[...] it&#8217;s a bit troubling that it takes an artificial reward system to keep me typing (see also: running, going outside, and god knows what else), but it works. In [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[…] it’s a bit troubling that it takes an artificial reward system to keep me typing (see also: running, going outside, and god knows what else), but it works. In […]</p>
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		<title>By: Simon Bostock</title>
		<link>http://quietbabylon.com/2010/points-for-everything/comment-page-1/#comment-1540</link>
		<dc:creator>Simon Bostock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Apr 2010 22:26:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://quietbabylon.com/?p=1735#comment-1540</guid>
		<description>A few things: some of the grinding games have great storylines - I&#039;m thinking of Echo Bazaar in particular. Though, you&#039;re right, this feels a bit like saying you read Playboy for the occasional Kurt Vonnegut piece.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;You&#039;re missing the potential with ubiquitous scoring mechs for Painting the Cowpaths. Sorry, I&#039;m going to point you to a (short) blog post: &lt;a href=&quot;http://hypergogue.posterous.com/paint-the-cowpaths&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://hypergogue.posterous.com/paint-the-cowpaths&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;The banality of hyperlinked documents allows the exciting part - we&#039;re all involved in multiple simultaneous/asynchronous/longitudinal conversational threads. The banality of grinding games and ubiquitous crappy Skinner-box game mechs will give rise to emergent games every bit as threaded/longitudinal as the wargames I use to play with imaginary forces in my childhood. Games all around means more vernacular materials to play with.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Possibly. Or, we&#039;ll skinner-box ourselves into a societal OCD Gamepocalypse as Jesse Schell&#039;s started calling it on his new blog.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Your point about Farmville and immunity is totally bang on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A few things: some of the grinding games have great storylines — I’m thinking of Echo Bazaar in particular. Though, you’re right, this feels a bit like saying you read Playboy for the occasional Kurt Vonnegut piece.</p>
<p>You’re missing the potential with ubiquitous scoring mechs for Painting the Cowpaths. Sorry, I’m going to point you to a (short) blog post: <a href="http://hypergogue.posterous.com/paint-the-cowpaths" rel="nofollow">http://hypergogue.posterous.com/paint-the-cowpaths</a></p>
<p>The banality of hyperlinked documents allows the exciting part — we’re all involved in multiple simultaneous/asynchronous/longitudinal conversational threads. The banality of grinding games and ubiquitous crappy Skinner-box game mechs will give rise to emergent games every bit as threaded/longitudinal as the wargames I use to play with imaginary forces in my childhood. Games all around means more vernacular materials to play with.</p>
<p>Possibly. Or, we’ll skinner-box ourselves into a societal OCD Gamepocalypse as Jesse Schell’s started calling it on his new blog.</p>
<p>Your point about Farmville and immunity is totally bang on.</p>
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		<title>By: KinoSport &#124; Datajack Five</title>
		<link>http://quietbabylon.com/2010/points-for-everything/comment-page-1/#comment-1539</link>
		<dc:creator>KinoSport &#124; Datajack Five</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Apr 2010 03:10:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://quietbabylon.com/?p=1735#comment-1539</guid>
		<description>[...] for the future of NYC, maybe it&#039;ll be a volcanic death cloud. Or a pixel invasion. Quiet Babylon tackles today&#039;s newfangled social media games, pointing out that &quot;we already have a [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[…] for the future of NYC, maybe it’ll be a volcanic death cloud. Or a pixel invasion. Quiet Babylon tackles today’s newfangled social media games, pointing out that “we already have a […]</p>
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		<title>By: Toolbarbabe</title>
		<link>http://quietbabylon.com/2010/points-for-everything/comment-page-1/#comment-1538</link>
		<dc:creator>Toolbarbabe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Apr 2010 16:36:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://quietbabylon.com/?p=1735#comment-1538</guid>
		<description>You have a point. I think it&#039;s a simple way for people to disconnect from reality. For a while they are the glamourized version of themselves. Being in the society we are in right now things are hard for everyone with bailouts, losing homes, jobs, etc., this is a quick fix for their psyche, to almost, make them feel better about themselves even if only temporarily.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You have a point. I think it’s a simple way for people to disconnect from reality. For a while they are the glamourized version of themselves. Being in the society we are in right now things are hard for everyone with bailouts, losing homes, jobs, etc., this is a quick fix for their psyche, to almost, make them feel better about themselves even if only temporarily.</p>
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		<title>By: asandiford</title>
		<link>http://quietbabylon.com/2010/points-for-everything/comment-page-1/#comment-1537</link>
		<dc:creator>asandiford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Apr 2010 14:55:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://quietbabylon.com/?p=1735#comment-1537</guid>
		<description>Your point about TV as a distraction in your notes is extremely interesting (as is the rest of the article).  I am similarly useless when a TV is on and I suspect it to be for the same reason (that and I haven&#039;t had cable in going on 12 years).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your point about TV as a distraction in your notes is extremely interesting (as is the rest of the article).  I am similarly useless when a TV is on and I suspect it to be for the same reason (that and I haven’t had cable in going on 12 years).</p>
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		<title>By: Adam Rothstein</title>
		<link>http://quietbabylon.com/2010/points-for-everything/comment-page-1/#comment-1536</link>
		<dc:creator>Adam Rothstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Apr 2010 04:39:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://quietbabylon.com/?p=1735#comment-1536</guid>
		<description>I played a Mafia-Wars-esque game for a while on my iPhone. I have a strange attraction to these &quot;leveling&quot; games. The goal, in my perspective, is to figure out the system, or the best way to level quickest, which can often change depending on how far you have leveled, and how complex the game is. Whenever I sit down to play Zelda or FF, I never finish the game. I play to the point at which the mathematical strategy required to level efficiently no longer becomes interesting, which is anywhere from 20% to 80% of the way &quot;through the story&quot;. (FF2 is my favorite FF, because the leveling system is so dynamic to the earned abilities.) Zapping endless peons with a beam sword just doesn&#039;t captivate me as much as &quot;mastering the system&quot;.  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;So in the Mafia Wars game, once I finally found the best way to, as you say, &quot;avoid playing the game&quot;, (or doing it as efficiently as possible), I found the only better way to avoid playing the game.... I stopped. I reached an asymptote of playability. (I sense most other players reached this as well... even the highest leveled players only played for ~80 days.)&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Now reading your post, it occurs to me: why do I bother with these games? A diversion from real life? Real life being, another system which we spend our lives trying to master. A system we don&#039;t always enjoy playing, though we convince ourselves to play, because if we get better at it, it will &quot;be more fun.&quot; Something we must keep telling ourselves, so we will never think we have already gotten as good as we can be at this system. So we keep playing.  After we have mastered life, the only way to increase our mastery of the system is to quit. Leveling systems are our way out of existential crisis. As long as we&#039;re getting somewhere, we&#039;re not nowhere.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;But I&#039;m not sure if there is any &quot;universal game&quot;. SF loves to depict universalities. The one TV show everyone watches, the most dangerous game, one ring to rule them all. As if real life was that simple. We get bored with universal systems quickly, and need to move on to something else, or need to change it up somehow. Start over with a new character. Try a new strategy. Doesn&#039;t the average WoW player have like  5+ characters? It&#039;s a new meaning to &quot;multiplayer&quot;. Even treating real life as a game is too simplistic, just because there are so many different lives to live, different chapters, etc. And different games at the same time. Even the hardcore Myst fans play solitaire once in a while. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Behold, the mini-game: a mindless diversion Easter Egged into a bigger game! Games upon games! Thousands of random number generators choosing to trigger thousands of random number generators! Enter user name for high score list: the multiplicity is at hand!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I played a Mafia-Wars-esque game for a while on my iPhone. I have a strange attraction to these “leveling” games. The goal, in my perspective, is to figure out the system, or the best way to level quickest, which can often change depending on how far you have leveled, and how complex the game is. Whenever I sit down to play Zelda or FF, I never finish the game. I play to the point at which the mathematical strategy required to level efficiently no longer becomes interesting, which is anywhere from 20% to 80% of the way “through the story”. (FF2 is my favorite FF, because the leveling system is so dynamic to the earned abilities.) Zapping endless peons with a beam sword just doesn’t captivate me as much as “mastering the system”.  </p>
<p>So in the Mafia Wars game, once I finally found the best way to, as you say, “avoid playing the game”, (or doing it as efficiently as possible), I found the only better way to avoid playing the game.… I stopped. I reached an asymptote of playability. (I sense most other players reached this as well… even the highest leveled players only played for ~80 days.)</p>
<p>Now reading your post, it occurs to me: why do I bother with these games? A diversion from real life? Real life being, another system which we spend our lives trying to master. A system we don’t always enjoy playing, though we convince ourselves to play, because if we get better at it, it will “be more fun.” Something we must keep telling ourselves, so we will never think we have already gotten as good as we can be at this system. So we keep playing.  After we have mastered life, the only way to increase our mastery of the system is to quit. Leveling systems are our way out of existential crisis. As long as we’re getting somewhere, we’re not nowhere.</p>
<p>But I’m not sure if there is any “universal game”. SF loves to depict universalities. The one TV show everyone watches, the most dangerous game, one ring to rule them all. As if real life was that simple. We get bored with universal systems quickly, and need to move on to something else, or need to change it up somehow. Start over with a new character. Try a new strategy. Doesn’t the average WoW player have like  5+ characters? It’s a new meaning to “multiplayer”. Even treating real life as a game is too simplistic, just because there are so many different lives to live, different chapters, etc. And different games at the same time. Even the hardcore Myst fans play solitaire once in a while. </p>
<p>Behold, the mini-game: a mindless diversion Easter Egged into a bigger game! Games upon games! Thousands of random number generators choosing to trigger thousands of random number generators! Enter user name for high score list: the multiplicity is at hand!</p>
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